tv Piers Morgan Tonight CNN November 26, 2011 6:00pm-7:00pm PST
and they just seem to be out of touch with the real world. >> outside iowa, as long as politics continues to dominate redistricting, congress will keep on running. much like a merry go round. once an incumbent gets on, most of them never have to get off. at the iowa state fair, drew griffin, reporting. ♪ tonight joel olstein, the man who preaches to a faithful flock of millions. last time he was here he made headlines by saying this. >> is homosexuality a sin in your eyes? >> yes, i've always believed the scripture says it's a sin. >> he's back and he'll be answering more questions. how do you explain a just god can allow these kind of atrocities to live in? >> the world we live in is not a
perfect world. >> what is your view on state executions? >> i'm for second chance and mercy. >> if i ask you about abortion, what would you say? >> my view is every baby should live. >> tonight joel and victoria olstein. >> it's great to be back with you. >> we're still praying for you. >> this is "piers morgan tonight." >> welcome back. seems like only yesterday you were gracing me with your presence. now you're here because you've got this great new book "every day is friday," how to you happier seven days a week and i'm thinking to myself you are the two happiest people i ever met anyway. how can you possibly get any happier? >> i think we all can if we learn what to ignore and what battles to fight. we all can be improving and growing and be happier.
>> why fridays? when i came in, i was horrified that my staff came in dressed like people from the street because it was dress down friday. apparently it means you dress badly with jeans and old t-shirts. i associate friday with this unkempt sort of misery. why do you select friday as a day of great joy and happiness? >> for the most people the study shows people are happier on fridays. >> why? >> i think people are looking for the weekend, get toing relax. i read there's more heart attacks on monday than any other day. >> the stress of going back to work? >> yes. >> is that because people don't like their jobs? i like mondays. i look forward to going back to work. i don't like fridays, every slows down. >> i'm the same way. we work weekends and i enjoy what we do. not everybody is like that. you've heard of that "thank god
it's friday." if we have the right perspective, we don't have to dread going to work, if if it's not the perfect job. if you have the right perspective, i'm alive, i'm healthy, i'm enjoying my life. >> the theme of the book is very much that you mack your own decisions about your life and your life will be happier. is it as simple as that? lots of people through circumstance are not really in the position to do much about their lot in life. it's easy to say. joel, you're worth $100 million. what about the poor guy trapped in a factory job or maybe has no job who just through lack of opportunity and bad circumstance is unhappy because he can't get out of that? >> well, piers, to me faith is all about learning about learning to be happy where you are. it doesn't take faith to be happy when everything's going your way and the economy is great and you get good breaks. there are many people in a
situation and it seems like they're stuck. my belief is if you put your trust in god, you can have peace and be happy right where you are. if you don't get happy where you are, you probably won't get to where you want to be because these are tests you have to pass as far as i'm concerned. you have to past that test, say god, i'm at a job, i don't like it but i'm going to be good to somebody and put a smile on my face anyway. you're releasing your faith and that's allows god to change things. >> do you believe fundamentally that money can make people happier? victoria, you're shaking your head. why? >> it helps. but i've seen people who are very wealthy and unhappy. they don't have good relationships and may in the have good health. >> i think i've met more unhappy rich people than poor people. i went to africa and people living in povertiy and some the happiest people i've ever met. their spirits were alive with
happiness. it was a fact, i saw it in my own eyes. why is it? why can poverty-stricken people sometimes find joy in their lives? >> i think there's not so many distractions. i think they have their priorities where they love their family, they're with their family, they don't have a million things that are getting them off course and they just take every day for what it is, just the simple things in life, getting up and enjoying family time and not fighting a lot of the battles we allow to steal our joy. >> does he ever get angry? is he always this content, happy chap? >> angry, no? is he content, yes. i think he choose it is. i think there are things that i'm sure are stressful. >> what really flips him out? >> i don't really think he flips out. but he likes things to be right. i've watched him when things aren't right and he chooses to see the best in a situation. he's always really great about finding what is right.
a lot of people have a tendency to look at the one wrong thing -- >> come on, you've never heard him shout? >> nosh he's never shouted -- if you live with me and you don't shout, you're pretty good. >> you're quite a live wire i remember from our last interview p . i imagine you can be quite lively, right? >> do you have a temper? >> i've grown out of my temper with him. >> you never shout at anybody? >> no, that's not my personality. a lot it have is your personality. i've been like this my whole life. >> you've never shouted in your life is this. >> i probably have. >> he doesn't really shout but he does have a look when he aggravated. >> what's the look? >> it's like -- >> and that's when you -- >> okay, kids, let's go, let's go. >> what frustrates and annoys you? what can ruin your friday?
>> i don't know if it would ruin my friday but like she said, i like things to be right. i like organization. i like to -- i expect excellence but not in the wrong sense but i believe we're supposed to be excellent. so if we put things into place and people aren't doing their job there are some times you think, okay, come on, guys, let's get going. but i choose to use that energy to make things right and not just to yell at people or anything like that. >> have you ever had a fist fight? >> i never had, no. >> not even as a kid? >> probably with my brother. >> you would wrestle with your brother but not a fist fight. >> have you ever been punched if the face? >> no. >> never? >> never have. >> incredible life you've had. >> i've been blessed. >> have you ever been punched in the face? >> yes. >> you have? >> yes, many times. i thought it was all part of life's rich tapestry. i meet someone like you and say i missed out here.
i could have lived a lie of total -- >> no, no. i used to get frustrated when this evenings weren't happening the way i wanted to or i had everything worked out and my plans didn't go the way i wanted it to. now i've learned to say god, here are my plans for the day. if it doesn't work out, god, i believe you're in control, you're opening the right doors. sometimes god closes a dr on purpose and i used to think that was a good opportunity, why didn't it work out? i've learned to trust. >> we had the tenth anniversary of 9/11 recently. it was extraordinary being in america. it's very hard to tell god fearing people who have prayed all their lives, it's very hard to tell them in they've lost relatives in that kind of thing that there is a merciful good. many of them, particularly if they're devout christians or muslims or all the denominations
who perished on that day, what do you say to them? how do you explain that a just good can allow these kind of atrocities to happen, ruining so many lives? >> it's difficult, piers, but the world we live in is not a perfect world. we're living in a fallen world. to simplify it, god's given us all our free choice. we can do what we want to do and unfortunately some people choose to do evil. god didn't make us his robots. it's hard to explain because god is good, obviously god could have stopped it but he didn't. but there's much about faith that i don't understand -- >> does your faith ever get dented? it always sounds very unequivocal. i watch you on sunday mornings. it's incredible to watch. i've had relatives renounce their catholic blaef and faith in god after the holocaust who couldn't understand how any god
could allow 5 million jews to have their lives taken in such a ghastly manner. it's hard to argue. i find it difficult. what do you say to people, again, who might come to you and say i can't continue having this faith because some appalling thing has happened? >> that happens from time to time but i go back to having faith means you're going to have unanswered questions. that's what faith is all about. i can't explain why parents will come to me and their little child has cancer. i still believe -- >> what do you say to them? >> i say god's got you in the palm of his hand, none of this is a surprise to god, you may be hurting, our hearts break with you, we're going to pray for you and god will give you a strength you never had before and you if you turn god and you don't get bitter and blame god and everybody else and give up on your dreams, i believe god can make the rest of your life still very fulfilling.
>> have you ever had your faith dented? >> well, no. i never have. it's like what joel is saying. a lot of times we want to see everything happen but god's a super natural god and he can bring grace and comfort into your life just by a state of peace and joy -- >> have you had moments, for example, when something bad's happened in your life or something that's really affected you badly and you prayed to god to have that situation end in a happy way and then it hasn't so your prayers haven't been answered. in that circumstance do you not feel slightly let down? >> well, you know what, i can't tell god what to do, i can ask him to do things for me but i know in my core he's got my best interests at heart and it may not look good but somehow some good can come out of it. you can't bring people back, you can't bring things maybe that you've lost back sometimes but god has a way of somehow getting
you out of yourself and into a new place in your life. >> let take a little break and come back and talk to you about executions, which is a burning issue right now. many people believing that america should join the rest of the world and abandon executions. you name it. i've tried it. but nothing helped me beat my back pain.
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do. today i will be taught the word of god. i boldly confess my mind is alert, my heart is receptive, i will never be the same. >> i'm with joel and victoria osteen. do you ever watch yourself back on tv? >> i do. i still edit my sermons. i edit with somebody now, but i did that 17 years for my dad. after i speak my sermon on sundays, i like to edit it because i know where i messed up and how i can do better. you know how you do with editing now. >> i watch you. it is almost always word perfect. you have an extraordinary style. how have you developed that? >> well, my mother has had a great memory.
when i started, my dad just spoke extemporaneously. i couldn't do that. i had to write down what i would say. i go over it two or three hours. i get it so much in me, it can come out pretty good now. >> there's pressure because you have so many people tuning in for these sermons. you can't get them wrong, can you? every word gets analyzed. >> you do. it makes me very responsible in what i'm going to say because people are going to -- you know, some people are making decisions based off of what you're saying. you have to say, okay, how is this coming across? this is how i mean it, so i try to think through it a lot. >> there was a recent survey, "new york times" named you one of the most influential figures on twitter. you beat lady gaga, justin bieber, rachel maddow, arianna huffington. some of the big tweeters themselves. because they deemed that your influence which they assessed by the number of your tweets that were retweeted actually exceeded
all of them. that shows you have proper influence and i would say power. >> well, i felt very honored when i heard that. but we found, piers, people come to us for inspiration for those little quotes. so we try to stay really focused on what can i speak to people that will help improve their day? my tweets are not about what i did that day. it's always about something that they can use. when you give people good material, they like to pass it on. because the fact is there's a lot pushing us down these days. there's a lot of negativity. when you say make somebody else's day and god will make your own day, you give them small tidbits like that. >> one of the things in the book is forgiveness of sins is one of the central tenets of christianity in many ways. you're a forgiving man. and your view of this. what is your view of state executions. the troy davis thing which happened recently where by
common consent there was enough doubt that that man could not be 100% said to have committed the crime, certainly no dna evidence. what do you think of the whole issue? >> it's a complicated issue. i haven't thought a whole lot about it. but of course, i'm for second chances and mercy. yet the flip side is there's consequences for what we've done. so i don't know what my total stance is because i'm so full of -- >> a life for a life? >> well, i don't know that that's -- you know, it's hard -- >> i don't think you can say this. i've had this debate with you before about these things. you can't be the man who influences millions of people and sit on the fence about key moral issue like that. key moral stroke ethical issues. you've got to have a view, haven't you? >> we have a justice system and i believe in our system of justice, number one. part of me, the human part of me, the merciful part of me is,
wow, let's just give everybody a chance and if there is any -- it's hard for me to say, yeah, let's kill this person because he's so bad. they can be redeemed. they can be forgiven, yet they still have to be put to death. that's hard for me. i don't know what is the right thing. there are smarter people than me that make all the laws. >> two-thirds of all executions in america are taking place in five states, most in southern states near where you're from including texas. texas may even be the highest in terms of executions for any state in america. so i guess the part of your issue, unless i'm wrong, is that a lot of your brethren that come to watch you presumably would support the death penalty? >> sure, i think so. i don't know for a fact, but i think many people do. and, you know, i just again, i don't know the right answer. it's hard for me to tell someone to be put to death. >> if you came out particularly in somewhere like texas, you joel osteen came out and said, enough. i don't think we can continue
with this particularly based on the facts. my problem with the whole death penalty debate are the statistics are alarming. over 100 people in america on death row have had their sentences commuted by new evidence. 17 of them because dna evidence proved they didn't commit the crime. when you hear that, surely you begin to think that this isn't right. and you have a lot of influence in your state. people will be watching this thinking, well, what does he think? is he in favor of state killings or is he actually against it? because they might take their lead from you. >> well, piers, i don't know that i'm the one to give the final answer on that. >> you're the perfect guy to ask. >> yes, piers, because i'm not studied on it and i stay focused on what i feel i'm called to do. i'm careful about -- it's a more complicated issue than that than to just throw that issue out there and create a lot of waves. >> if i asked you about abortion, what would you say? >> abortion i feel stronger
about. >> what's your view? >> that every baby should live. that god's created that life. been -- again, that's what i feel strongly about. >> there's a contradiction between the sanctity of life with an abortion and the sanctity of life with somebody who may or may not have committed a crime. >> sure. >> should there not be a more consistent view. >> there could be. when you say may or may not, that's the troublesome thing when we don't know for sure. >> how can you know for sure really? very few cases are completely clear cut and really just comes down to a general principle whether in a modern civilized society, you know, especially in a country with millions, tens of millions go to church every sunday. they look to religious leaders to say what should we be thinking? they're all a bit confused. i know i do this to you when you come on, but i feel like you
need to be more definitive. >> well, if i could, i would. but let me study it and i'll come back with a great answer some day for you. >> let's have a little break and i'll come back and pin you to the floor on another issue where i tried to pin you to the floor before and see if your views have changed on homosexuality in light of the fact that you have five states in america who now support same-sex marriage. [ male announcer ] you are a business pro. premier of the packed bag. you know organization is key... and so is having a trusted assistant. and you...rent from national. because only national lets you choose any car in the aisle...and go. you can even take a full-size or above and still pay the mid-size price. here we are... [ male announcer ] and there you go, business pro. there you go. go national. go like a pro. there you go. when you're a sports photographer, things can get out of control pretty quickly. so i like control in the rest of my life... especially my finances.
back with my guests the osteens. another contentious issue, joel, because last time you came on this show, you were excellent guests. this happened. i want to talk about this after because it made a few headlines. yes is homosexuality a sin in your eyes? >> yes, i always believed that the scriptures show this is a sin. but i'm not one of those who are out there to bash homosexuals and tell them that they're terrible people and all that. >> so i suppose the obvious question is we did that back in january. has your position changed at all after that? because it raised a lot of headlines, a lot of controversy. since then more states have endorsed same-sex marriage. it's becoming much less of a prohibitive kind of issue than it used to be. what's your view now? >> you know, piers, it never
really changes because mine is based out of the scripture. that's what i believe that the scripture says, that homosexuality was a sin. i believed it before and i still believe it now. i will reiterate what i said. i'm not mad at anybody, i don't dislike anybody. but respecting my faith and believing in what the scripture says, that's the best way i can interpret it. >> but shouldn't the scripture be dragged kicking and screaming into the modern age? we were talking before about the issue of an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth, not everything in the scriptures really is, in my view, conducive to modern life. like everything else, doesn't it have to move with the times? and for people like you to interpret it in a way that evolves when you're known as a very progressive preacher. >> sure, well, i want to be progressive, but sometimes when i read it, i can't see how you would change that just like you wouldn't change some other main things in the scripture. i don't see how that -- if you
don't have a basis of truth -- and that's what i base mine off of, the scripture. everybody else doesn't and i don't fault them if they don't. this is how i choose to lead my life. i think personally 200 years from now the scripture's still going to say that. >> but the law of the land may not and it may not in your state and the law of the land is changing fast. your argument about executions was when it was the law of the land in somewhere like texas. and what if texas, an unlikely place to bring this in but it may change with enough pressure, texas brings in a law that same-sex marriage is permissible, how would you feel then if it's the law of the land? >> i'm going to respect the law and respect gay people like i do now. we have plenty of people that come to our church and friends that are gay, so i'll respect that. where it puts a difficult situation is me being a christian pastor believing the
scripture, it would be against my faith to marry two gay people. >> you wouldn't do that. >> no, that's where the rub comes in of people like myself. it's not that i'm against anybody or if people want to live together, that's up to them. but my faith, when we say marriage, i think about, piers, all through the bible, there's hundreds of marriages but none of them are shown as between the same sex. again, i'm not against anything, but i just believe that's what the bible teaches. >> so you feel a bit uneasy that the last person i heard speaking like this was mahmoud ahmadinejad who says there are no gay people in iran and it's a terrible sin and curse. what do you think about this gay marriage debate? can you ever imagine attending a
gay marriage between two people who come to your church if they invited you? >> i think if it was that easy, then we would have figured it out by now. it's been overthrown, states go for it. so it's very difficult for people -- >> so would you accept one or not? >> would i accept one? >> two gay people who attend your church invite you to your wedding? >> sure, i would go. >> you would? >> well, if i had time i would. >> if they were friends of mine and i respect them, i would certainly go. >> you would watch two people you think are sinners committing the ultimate sin? >> i'm looking at it i don't think it's the ultimate sin. but i'm looking at it out of respect to that person. it gets convoluted, but i'm looking at it as respect to that person. >> could you in your position actually actively encourage people to go through a same-sex marriage? could you be photographed at such an event? wouldn't that cause you problems? >> well, you know, it's such a hypothetical. >> not really. because you said lots of gay people go to your church. so it might happen. >> well, i haven't been to any weddings lately to begin with, but i'm talking about somebody who was dear to us. i'm not going to disrespect somebody that's dear to us and
say, you know what? you're not good enough for us or something like that. that's the way i would see it. now, i'm not going to just run off and attend certain marriages just to make a statement because that's not who i am and that's not what i stand for. again, don't look down on those people. >> let's talk a little more about politics. i know it's a bit of a minefield for you. i'm curious what you think of all the republican writers at the moment, who's been catching your eye as potentially a leader for america. [ woman on radio, indistinct ] ♪ bum-bum ♪ bum-bum, bum-bum, bum-bum ♪ ♪ ai, ai, ai ♪ bum-bum ♪ bum-bum, bum-bum ♪ [ ice rattles rhythmically ] ♪ [ imitates guitar noise ] the redesigned, 8-passenger pilot. smarter thinking. from honda. i have to be a tree in the school play. good. you like trees.
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a body found buried in a shallow grave may be linked to ohio's so-called craigs there list killer. the fbi believes the body is of a man who has been missing for more than a week after answering a fake craigslist job ad. another man who responded to the same ed was found dead, another man was shot. >> in philadelphia tonight a home coming for one of the three american college students accused of throwing a molotov cocktail during the unrest in
egypt. he thanked his lawyers and the embassy in cairo for his freedom. the other two college students are expected to arrive home tonight. >> the national highway traffic safety administration says the volt lithium ion batteries could catch fire in a crash. gm insists the car is safe. join us in 15 minutes for the latest news of the day. cnn's "piers morgan tonight" continues in a moment. joel and victoria osteen. politics for a moment because i know as i said before the break, a bit of a minefield. but of all the republican runners and writers in the race so far to be the nominee. who do you think is the most impressive leader potentially that you've seen. >> they all look like great
leaders to me. >> that's a terrible answer. >> i can't pick out one. governor perry is a governor of texas, a friend of ours. i've never met him. a great governor. i never met mitt romney, but he looks fantastic. smart people. i can go down the row. i don't know. >> rick perry won't be a friend much longer if you keep saying how fantastic mitt romney is. you have to make your mind up somewhere along the line. you have to back the right horse, eh? >> to me i'm taking it all in like everybody else. i'm just an outsider looking in. >> you are a republican, aren't you? you have to be. >> i voted both ways before. >> really? >> i'm conservative. that's who i've always been. >> you're very conservative, aren't you? >> i like to vote on the candidate. >> who do you like? >> who do i like? i'm still watching. >> right now if you had to put an x by someone's name? >> good thing i don't have to now because it's too early in the race. >> victoria, what do you think
are the key issues in society today? what do you think people most care about? >> are you talking about political issues? >> anything. people come to your church. >> their relationships, finances and their health. >> i would say that's what most people care most about. do you think politicians today are doing the right kind of thing or are they too busy squabbling with each other in washington to understand as clearly as you just defined it what the real issues are for people in america? >> yes, i think they're squabbling too much. >> what's that? >> yes, i think they're squabbling too much. >> they spent a lot of time shouting at each other. you just said that you don't shout. when you see them ranting and raving and being deliberatively obstructive to getting things down, what do you think? >> i would think as most americans i would hope that they would work together. what i see that's difficult these days is any kind of compromise. it's hard to get 100% of what you want. just like some of these issues we're talking about. it's getting difficult for
people to say nothing will get done if we don't come together. that would be my hope that we would, you know, but it's difficult. >> are you comfortable with a mormon becoming president? mitt romney or jon huntsman. they're both mormons. would you be comfortable with that? >> i would be comfortable -- that would not stop me from voting for somebody. i would look at the total candidate, though. what's their experience, what's their education, what do they stand for? i don't think i would vote for somebody just because they're a mormon or anything like that. >> are there aspects to mormonism which you find offensive? >> i don't know a lot about it. here i go again -- >> how can you keep saying that? >> i don't know a lot about it. >> i bet you do. you don't want me to think you know a lot about it, otherwise it makes the argument more difficult. >> i haven't studied it. i hear things from time to time. there are things about the mormon religion that i don't agree with. >> like what? >> there's different degrees in religion, too. just like being a christian. these people think it's okay to
do this, this and this and they're christian. like you say, the catholic church, they won't let you do this, and this and this. it's degrees of how you practice that religion. >> what are the things about mormonism that are awkward for you? >> i don't know enough about their beliefs to point it out, articulate it well. here's what i believe. mitt romney says that he believes jesus is the son of god, he believes jesus is the savior, to me those are the fun -- foundational things when i look at somebody, i don't know what all the other church doctrine is. >> could you vote for a jewish candidate? >> sure, i could vote for a jewish candidate. they're god's chosen people in the scripture. i mean, sure i could. >> so you don't mind which
religion. could you vote for a muslim candidate? >> i think i could. it's so hypothetical because if we're talking about for america, 90% of america is christian so i am pretty sure that i would find somebody that more shares my beliefs and is educated and qualified. so it's hard for me to go there because i don't think we'll come to that point. >> what do you make of what's going on with the palestinians and the israelis right now? >> well, it's a difficult situation. it's been that way for so many years. you know, like the scripture says we pray for peace over there, we stand with the israeli people, our hearts go out to the palestinian people as well. they want peace, they want to live their life in victory. it's a difficult thing. >> you both went out there recently to israel, right? >> we did. we went out in february. >> tell me about that. how did you find it? >> we found it very peaceful. it's amazing, country that has
been under such conflict for so long. you hear it's dangerous but the people are very solid, they're very peaceful. they have a lot of confidence in the fact they're going to be okay. yes, they want to fight for what they feel like is rightfully theirs but it was quite interesting, we had a night of hope over there and we had -- the auditorium was full. we had a wonderful time and we thought it was a very fascinating -- it really brings the bible alive, you go to these places where jesus walked, where he prayed, where the disciples were, the sea of galilee. we found it fascinating. >> does it bother you so many conflicts in the world are religion prompted? they all turn out to be excuses to kill people? >> it's been that way for hundreds if not thousands of years. so it is a shame that we can't get along in the day that we're living in today that you would think you still have to kill people to try to get your point
of view. it is difficult but you have to keep believing and hoping and praying. i think that's all can you do in some of these situations. >> let's take another break and cop back and talk about osteen incorporated, the burgeoning empire of the number one rock star preacher of the world. you don't look like a rock star. [ woman ] my boyfriend and i were going on vacation, so i used my citi thank you card to pick up some accessories. a new belt. some nylons. and what girl wouldn't need new shoes? we talked about getting a diamond. but with all the thank you points i've been earning... ♪ ...i flew us to the rock i really had in mind. ♪ [ male announcer ] the citi thank you card. earn points you can use for travel on any airline, with no blackout dates.
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you're going to have everything god intended for you to have. i believe it and declare it over each one of you. if you receive it, can you say amen tonight. amen. >> some of the stats on your business empire are quite extraordinary. joelosteen.com -- you have a million daily requests for your e-mailed daily inspirational message. this is the stuff of empires. you're aired in a hundred countries. did you ever stop and think, wow, how did this happen? >> i do stop and think about that often, especially, piers, when i never planned on doing this. 12 years ago i was running camera at my dad's church, doing the production, things like
that. i never thought i'd get out of people, i never wanted do it. i liked being behind the scenes. when my dad died, i felt like i was supposed to step up and pastor the church. here we are. >> you make vast sums of money. the church takes in $18 million a year but all of that gets plowed back into the church; is that right? >> that's correct. >> but on the books you keep all the cash? >> well, we give. we're big givers, i promise you that. >> takers as well? >> sure. >> keep some of it? >> we do. >> when you have to pay the light bill, you know. >> exactly. but you're like multi-millionaires, aren't you? >> well, we don't have any problem -- i don't think god has any problem with you being blessed. it's where your heart is. our hear was never to just go out and make money and be rich and that. it's fulfill our purpose. >> do you like being rich? >> i like being able to help others and fulfill my dream. it takes money to do what i'm
doing. >> are you like willy wonka? do you walk around bailing people out? when you hear about problems, do you go around, are you look that? do you give to people who come to you for help? >> sure, sure, we give to people. the church gives to people. we support works overseas, we work with organizations to get child sponsorships to feed and clothe and education children. we feel like that's why god gives you influence, to help the world, make it a better place. >> what do you think when president obama brings in a new tax on the super rich, everyone over a million dollars, which would include you guys. do you feel like he's on the right track? would you happily write more money to the treasure? >> again it's so far out of my league -- >> do you mind paying more tax? >> i don't mind doing what -- >> that's a different question.
what would you say do you like it? >> no, i'd rather have all the money and the government run great without the money and i'd give it away to other people. it's not practical. we have to have infrastructure and all the other. >> what do you think about the principle of rich people paying more tax anyway? >> i pay a good amount of tax right now it is. so you know, i think that the theory of taxing the rich has been kind of the conservative thought is that the more you tax the rich, the less they're going to be able to bring on new jobs and to do these things. >> do you believe all that? isn't it just a convenient thing that rich people come out with? >> i don't know. i think it's interesting when the luxury tax was applied that you know, it's just -- it's not like they're just trying to spend money. they quit spending money. so they took the luxury tax away. i think it's a complicated issue. i think that you know, just like
you, you know, do you want to pay more taxes. >> i wouldn't mind. i think in principle, americans pay a lot less tax than we do in britain, for example, a lot less which may be why we're in the financial crisis we're in now. for a long time, tax rates have been a lot higher in britain. i don't have a problem with that. i have a problem with the ideology of the rich paying a higher tax bracket than the poor. many people in america do. i think bart of that is the class structure here unlike in britain where it depends on who your parents are and where you win the to school, america is based around working hard, achieving success and the money comes with that. you're the perfect examples of this. it's a different class you can have tour, isn't it? >> i think it is. you know, i agree with what victoria said. even what you said. we don't mind paying to help others as long as it's done fair and somebody has figured out the best way to do it. we live in a great country. we feel blessed to live here and the freedom and the -- just the,
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back with us. you'll be pleased to know this is the final segment. three minutes of hell left, joel, and you're off the hook again. do you like being interview or do you find it a bit of a mine field? >> you know what? i enjoy it. i don't always know the subjects i'm not always familiar with, but i enjoy talking with different people. especially you. >> your two children are both beginning to show signs of real talent. alexandre sings, she's 13. jonathan is in a band, 16. would you like them to do what you did, take over the business if you suddenly weren't around? would you be happy with that. >> i'd be thrilled. nothing greater than for your children to follow in your legacy. i can't call them. i can't make them. it has to be a calling that they feel from on high. but you know, what i like about
them is they're way further along than i was at ha age. i wouldn't get up in front of people. they're very comfortable and great kids. >> do they have to lead really squeak kiki clean lives? 16-year-old boys, this is the time they're getting into too many pints of skyedder. are you goi . >> i never feel like it like that. we try to set a good example in front of them and our best. but they're great kids. i'm sure they're going to have challenges like we all do, but i don't feel -- my parents never made me go to church. we went to church because all of our friends were there. they're the same way. my daughter had me getting to church at 7:00 the other morning. she said we're getting there early. their friends are there. sometimes when you overpressure, i mean, i think the key, piers is to set a good example at home. we have fun and don't have to
have a lot of other things to make us happy. >> could you enjoy all this without victoria? she's looking at you really adoringly. >> i wouldn't enjoy it half as much. i don't think i would be half of who i am without victoria. she hayes spoken faith to me before i was a pastor. she used to say, one day you're going to pastor the church. that would make me mad. i would say i don't know how to speak. i don't know how to speak. she kept speaking those faith into me. we have fun together, too. we take life seriously but we have fun together. >> victoria, how do you have fun together? what's he talking about? >> we have good conversations. we like to do a lot of the outdoor things together. >> what's his favorite thing you like to do together, on a friday when you're feeling your happiest, what's the thing you most like? what's your perfect friday? >> we like to have a good dinner and like to either ride our bikes or we like to just hang out and talk or you know, we may have a few friends over. >> do you love him as much as
you did the day you first met him. >> absolutely, and i respect him even more. >> what's the secret of the joel osteen magic do you think? >> i think he's a man of his word. i think he's a man of his word. he's always looking for the best in any situation. he's very respectful. he's very generous. and he's very kind and he's extremely wise. >> would you agree with all that, joel? >> that and more. >> left a few things out. he's good looking. >> you can't ignore it. you must get some groupies. >> oh, i have some kind people. i don't call them groupies but people feel like you've helped them. >> attractive younger women wanting to throw themselves at you? >> are you like a tom jones? >> no, no, not in the work we do. there's people that are respectful. i don't ever feel that. >> victoria, do you ever have to step in and just, back off, he's mine? >> well, you know, it's funny because when i'm out